Subject: IPP> Re: JMP> jmJobState and jmJobStateReasonsTC [ISSUE: Are

From: Harry Lewis <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 28 May 1997 11:40:03 -0400

I wish I knew who wrote this... they did not sign it... I will insert comments
with >HRL.

>At 11:14 05/27/97 PDT, Harry Lewis wrote:
>>Even printers that don't spool or queue will typically "buffer" some number of
>>pages.

>But isn't the definition of "queuing" on page 13, line 364, what you mean
>by "buffering" some number of jobs?

>HRL You could say that except the definition implies that the device can
>HRL order - i.e. take some action regarding the order of jobs - whereas
>HRL a buffer can only "stage" nor "order". We're splitting hairs.

>>Given the possibility of single page jobs... then some jobs can be
>>pending. I guess we should ask ourselves what it means to have a "mandatory"
>>state. Just because a state is Mandatory does not mean an implementation must
>>"force" jobs to enter that state. If that were so... I'd REALLY be in favor of
>>eliminating the NeedsAttention state! ;->

>We keep getting confused by whether a MIB is talking about the printer
>or is talking about what the agent shall show about the printer.
>I claim that MIBs are all about the latter and nothing to do with
>the former.

>HRL You've mesmerized me, here. By the way... this is a *job* MIB.

>See my early answer to Ron about the completed state.

>HRL Who are you?

>Most printers won't have such a state, the printer throws the job away as soon
>as it
>is printed.  Its the agent that has to keep the job information in the
>MIB tables for the time indicated in the jmGeneralJobPersistence object.
>If the 'completed' state were conditionally mandatory, then an agent would
>only have to show jobs in the 'completed' state, if the device implemented
>the completed state. But we aren't going to allow agents off the hook.
>The agent has to implement the 'completed' state. Same for 'aborted'.

>HRL Now I'm slipping into a coma. We're talking about a *job* agent here
>HRL that is *embedded* in the device, totally for the purpose of representing
>HRL what is happening with the *job* in the device. Why are you making a
>HRL distinction between the agent and the device? Besides. We can't go on
>HRL discussing which jmJobState values are mandatory! The OID is mandatory,
>HRL and there are a list of possible values. If that possibility never
>HRL becomes reality, that object never assumes that value!

>'canceled', is conditionally mandatory, because level 1 IPP doesn't require
>the CancelJob operation.  So we aren't going to force agents to show
>a canceled state, except for printers that implement a CancelJob operation.

>For needsAttention, is impossible to design a device that handles paper
>that doesn't need attention some time (unless it plants, grows, harvests trees,
>makes paper, and fixes all jams).  So making needsAttention Mandatory forces
>the agent to show jobs in the needsAttention state, if the printer jams.

Harry Lewis - IBM Printing Systems